232. The Private Equity CFO: Myths, Mistakes & Misconceptions with Richard Sanders

Episode 232. The Private Equity CFO | Myths, Mistakes & Misconceptions with Richard Sanders

Hannah Munro Time Stamp 0:49

Hello everybody, and Welcome to what is the final episode of this series?
Hopefully not the last episode we do on Private Equity. And we are going to finish up with some good old myth busting around Private Equity and how that works. So, I'd like to welcome back our returning guest, Mr. Richard Sanders, who is founder and Managing Partner of Sullivan Street Partners, and I have got the alliteration right on the last episode. Can I just say?

Richard Sanders 01:16

Nailed it.

Hannah Munro 01:18

It just rolls off the tongue now, so, but thank you again, Rich, you've been absolutely amazing during this series, and I'm very excited to finish off with this episode.
So I'm going to throw some myths around Private Equity at you, and then hopefully you are going to come back and tell me whether they're true or false, and give us some context, perhaps, about where some of these things are coming from and I think that is the challenge, isn't it?
That there is, there's so much noise around Private Equity, some of it probably fairly deserved, and maybe some of it not so.
So, I'm going to give the first P is focused on growth rather than profit.
How true or false is that statement?

Richard Sanders 2:04

Yeah, so I'd start generally, I think these myths got so many advisors and interested parties and recruiters, and actually the number of direct conversations that happen like this are very few, which is one of the reasons I was really encouraged to do this series, was to sort of bring this all to life, growth versus profit right now, what I would say is a zero growth plan is not going to get much attention from a Private Equity house. It's just not but that is very different to saying that Private Equity is only interested in growth versus profit, and it depends, again, on the scale of business.
So, if you're a venture business, you have to grow because you're next to nothing. And again, it's growth at all costs. Off you go, like, grow, grow, grow. If you're a traditional business, you want a growth plan, but what nearly all Private Equity will do is weigh up the different levels of profit you can deliver. And one of the big trade-offs there is, how much are you investing for the future versus how much are you realising in that year? And like we've talked about in the cycle, that's not a straightforward question to answer, but what is definitely true is it's not all of one or the other. Like, I've told you, you cannot have a zero-growth plan like that. Just doesn't work. But yeah, where you might cost cut to grow profit or something like that? No, you've got to have growth. But actually, the degrees of profit you're realising is a discussion. So yeah, it's not as simple as the myth would, uh, make it, make it.

Hannah Munro 3:42

Sound like Myth number two, slightly on the same track. In PE you need to put high numbers on the table or in the budget, even if they're unachievable.
How true or false is that one?

Richard Sanders 3:55

Yeah? Well, yeah, this does my head in actually, because it's one of those. Again, it's like, if you've been in a budgeting process, you have lots of different approaches, like negotiation approaches. One starts on the left, the other starts on the right. It's never that simple. And I think I've heard this before, oh, you've got to put some big numbers down, otherwise you're out. You know? You've got to be the one that's put this down, and then six months later, it's unachievable. That actually is more cause for concern. So, I would always talk to CFOs and CEOs about challenging but achievable, you know, again, so you don't want a bit of a dab squib in terms of a plan, you want something that's got some ambition in it. It's going to have some energy. Have some energy in it and some drive. And if you don't feel that, then again, maybe you know this isn't the right business for you anymore, or the Right Sector, or the right ownership structure. So, you could have some, you know, fire about it, but to be achievable, because you're going to be expected to achieve them, you.

Hannah Munro 5:00

And so, we talked about along those same lines, you know, obviously putting some ambitious targets on the table. Can, you know, can mean there's more opportunity for things to go wrong. So, no mistakes are allowed in private actor, you get one shot, and if you fail, you're out. How true or false is that?

Richard Sanders 5:25

Well, I guess it depends on how big the one mistake is. It's like an open I don't see it like that, like, I think the businesses we inherit often have kind of some areas where there's stagnating plans, like, where we think actually there's better that can be done in those areas, if you move at a pace, that means you only ever get things right. You will miss out on opportunities by definition. So, we talk about running experiments, right? So, a really good example of this is like in marketing, if you're not running experiments in marketing, you're not learning as fast as you can, and you might therefore, with hindsight, realise that campaign didn't work. This campaign didn't work, but this one did, and then you adjust, the game is definitely not, and you cannot have this game in business that you get everything right all of the time. If you do, you're in a blessed sector, and I'd like to know what it is, and I'd like to buy into it, right? It just doesn't work like that. And then even the best plan, best business, best situation, there'll be a problem with the person that's delivering it, like they'll have to go off thick, or something like that will happen. So, yeah, those attitudes around you know, it plans great until the first point of contact, right? The first action, or you get punched in the face. Mistakes happen, and I think anyone who's got any like depth of experience in primary equity will recognise that what you really need, though, and this is different to the avoiding mistakes or avoiding risk, is you need self-awareness and you need a team. They're going to tell you where something is starting to fail and failing fast. For me is critical to that experimental approach to rapid learning, to trust and transparency. For me, that's much more important now, all of that said, it does depend, yeah, the size of the mistake, the how high, how high profile the job is that you're doing. And if you've been brought in to do one thing, and you fail in that one thing, then obviously that's different, but that's these are rare occasions, especially in the mid cap, you're being brought in as a CFO to do a broad bunch of things, and not everything's going to go right and

Hannah Munro 7:39

like, let's help lawlessness qualify the size of the mistake, right? What's the, what would you class as the sorts of things that are immediate, your gum kind of pieces?

Richard Sanders 7:54

For me, there's like, red lines around, like, personal behaviour, fairness, equity, that side of things, and that is, I think, like that's just any work environment. It should work like that. I'd like to think in Private Equity, it works even more like that. On those kind of red lines about being fair, it won't always, but I'd like to think that that's the case. I think in terms of scale of mistake, the biggest mistakes I can remember from people and companies that I've seen and worked like alongside or either or actually sometimes coming in to fix those mistakes, the worst ones are where actually something's gone wrong early and no one's admitted it. So actually, it's that mistake that had avoidable consequences where you didn't change course, you didn't admit the failure, and you continue to persevere with a plan that wasn't working. Now, that can be because you haven't set the project up correctly. It's often because you don't admit the problem that, for me, is a monumental mistake, because it then ultimately leads to the fact you can't be trusted to run those projects again or those experiments, that's when you end up sort of sidling up to the door. You know you're heading in that direction. I think you're always going to measure a mistake in terms of financial loss, of course, risk that you've put the business in. But the majority of things that you're doing as part of the business plan are not such that you don't know as it's happening, whether something's working or not, and some of the bigger ones, the CFO might face off like a systems change or something like that, entry into a new market, acquisition of a new business. So, do your diligence? Agree the diligence with everybody around the table, including the investment directors, and then have an approach that means you find out fast if it's not working as you thought, like

Hannah Munro 9:47

that. No, that's really good. It's, it's, it's not, it's just putting that sort of those markers in place that when you do something big, right, you figure out whether it's working or not nice and early on, because that's what they're looking for. Know This is you're always going to, you're going to be the perfect person with the A star and the and the green score sheet, as it were, that's it.

Richard Sanders 10:09

How do you know it's working? How do you know it's not working? Those are good questions. One

Hannah Munro 10:13

of the hardest things, I think, is actually putting into words what it means to work with myself and the team here at itas. Because not only are we a financial transformation consultancy, but we do it using sage technology. So rather than me tell you how awesome we are, let me introduce one of our customers. We were.

Hannah Munro 11:19

so, oh, this is an interesting one. Pe is a guaranteed pot of gold to make good money as a CFO; you need to be in Private Equity.

Richard Sanders 11:28

True. Oh, yeah, that's just like, 100% true. No, of course not. Of course not. It's and again, to some extent, you don't mind people thinking that a little bit, because you want them to be attracted to Private Equity. I want people to work with us. But one any deal is not a guaranteed outcome, like it's just, it's just not. Otherwise, there'd be no challenge in the pursuit, there'd be 1000s of people doing it. It would have been done before. There are reasons why things don't happen, and you're expected to agitate to do a better job this next time, and some of that doesn't come off, like we just said, with making mistakes. So, this performance as a reason that that's not true. There's also your own stake in the game. So, you have to think carefully about the trade-off between I'll pick one alternative. So, say you're in a big corporate versus in a mid-sized business, in Private Equity, the two can be quite different, right? In lots of different dimensions. You can almost see the table with the side-by-side comparison, like, yeah, salary, bonus, equity, those are obviously points of comparison, working hours, chance, progression, continuous professional development. Those will be really different. Expectations will be different. Level of self-determination will be different. You know, the tightness of a team that you're working with will be different, and that'll work for some and not for others. So, one thing that people underweight is their ability to stay the course and get to the end of an investment. If they're new to Private Equity, you've got to thought about, like, where are you coming from and to and some, some will be really close. And like, chances are you've had some experience of something like Private Equity if you're going to make that step into it. So, you should know, so you should know, but just because you start an investment doesn't necessarily mean you finish it, and that's down to you and your fit and your performance. The investor directors, the business performance, everything else. So, it's definitely not a guaranteed pot of money. And I think something that, again, you need to be mindful of, is there are risks around your personal like the individual stakes so your equity. So, some people, some of the audience here will know about good levers and bad leavers when it comes to whether you get your shares. So, we are we at Sullivan Street are strong on the fact that you will get your shares, you'll have to get you get them over a number of years. So, we have this vesting period of, you know, 345, years. But if you've worked a year, our view is, unless you've committed fraud or done something really bad, you've earned that equity, and so you get it, but that's not the common view, right? So, a lot of people will have it that if you don't stay the course to the end, when the exit is you might not get anything at all in the equity. And some people will take a salary sacrifice to get into Private Equity, and bonuses, again, depends which sector, but bonuses aren't necessarily bigger in terms of cash paid bonuses. It's often all in the equity. So, when you're going into, say, a third-round interview, so not the first round, but the third-round interview with a Private Equity house, you should be asked. Thing about lever provisions, because the difference between different houses on this is huge. And if you don't understand actually what the bad lever definition is, you cannot value your equity full stop. You just can't, because things will happen that are out of your control and that might lead to you exiting the business you need to know, equity you get in that situation. So hopefully not. And I'm not saying that, like, certainly not with us like CFOs. We don't churn them by deliberately. It's just, you know, we hold businesses for like, six years. So, you know, people are hopefully there for the whole of the six years. Maybe it's two CFOs over that period. You know, it varies, but you've got to have asked that question, if you're a CFO CEO or anyone of the exec about good leave a bad leave.

Hannah Munro 15:48

So, so that is where so, so each private equities definition of what is a good versus bad lever will change, yeah, and I'm guessing the equity provision will vary dramatically according to those definitions and how, how that works.

Richard Sanders 16:07

Your likely outcome will vary significantly, right? So, it can vary. It often varies deal to deal, let alone house to house, right? So, there might be some principles from the Private Equity house. It's a framework for the deal. But then there'll be specifics for your industry sector and the individual asset that's being talked about. Okay, so the obvious elements that you'll see there will be in terms of incentives. It's like, if you hit 10 million EBITDA, you get this, yeah, if you hit 15 million EBITDA, you get that, and it's more so that will be talked about, the fact it's vesting over four years will be talked about, and you'll put that into your spreadsheet, and you'll work out where you think you can get to, the bit that's in the legal document is, what are the things that you can do wrong that lead to you being exited right? If something does go wrong and you exit under what circumstances you get to keep what you've earned up until that point, and what the other areas where you don't get to keep anything? So, you should, like people should, go and inquire about that. And there's, there's no harm in that discussion up front. That's not a confrontational discussion to have. But I wouldn't do it first interview. I'd do it like third round or something like that, but you've got to have that discussion before you join, because otherwise you don't understand, actually, the incentive that's often one of the main driving factors as to why you've joined Private Equity in the first

Hannah Munro 17:32

place. So, let's just talk about joining Private Equity for a second then, because that kind of leads on. So, what to get into PE you have to have a big, full background. True or False?

Richard Sanders 17:46

I'd say false. I think you know, one of the ways that people get into Private Equity, let's be honest, is by having been in Private Equity already. There's a lot of recycling, particularly of CFOs, and I know that a lot of recruiters will get who are recruiting CFOs will like for Private Equity. First thing the Private Equity house will say must have some prior experience of Private Equity. So, there's just a reality there that this is a kind of loop that keeps on going round. And if you're a bit unlucky and you're in a cycle, maybe a little bit like we're in at the moment, it could be harder to get into than in cycles where there's there are more deals than CFOs. So that's just the reality. What Private Equity house or any exec or CEO is looking for is a very competent CFO. So, number one for me, is proven track record of results, and ideally proven track record of results in as close a situation as to the situation you're about to face as possible. Now what I'd say is your big four experience isn't that your big four experience are your smart credentials, technical skills, and actually you can learn those at other places, but you'll get real credit for what you've learned if you've put it into practice and delivered results. So instead of thinking about that as a barrier to entry, I'd use it as a resolve to say, I'm going to have to demonstrate results more than the next person, if that next person is Big Four, and that's true, like, if everything else is equal, where you take a big four over a sort of mid-tier, you might, you might, because it's one less risk. But I think actually, some mid-sized teams, you're better suited to working then in mid-sized businesses, you've probably had to do a little bit more yourself. You're a bit more self-starting, you know, in some of the very small places, you've actually had to be very close to businesses all the way through, you don't think about yourself as a professional services person. You think about yourself as someone who's driving value in a company. Well, that's very, very interesting. So have a think about that and definitely think about how you present. Self on that basis. Do not try and present yourself as a big four type person. If you're not a big four type person, go with your individual strengths and keep on going until you find the Private Equity house or the executive team that appreciates that.

Hannah Munro 20:15

Okay, so follow up question then, because that kind of leads on. So, to get into PE it's all about who you know, not what you know, true or false.

Richard Sanders 20:25

Well, it doesn't work like that with us, right? I don't know. I guess at various points that's possibly been true in history, and recommendations and references definitely help. So, there's a little bit of that, but it's honestly about getting a job done. So, if you've got the relevant experience, then I don't agree, like I don't think it's true. Where you haven't got the relevant experience, again, you've got two CVS that aren't quite what you need, and if someone gives you a referral saying they've actually got brilliant motivation or high energy or something like that. That means a little bit then about who you know, but so far down the list in terms of like, it's definitely not what you set out looking for. You're trying to hire a CFO. I want someone who's delivered results in broadly the same context, who's got that energy and zeal, and ideally, that's going to bring something beyond just the core of running the finance team. It's going to bring some added value on top. Well, that's down to most individuals. Most individuals who are right for this would be able to address those questions. So yeah, I think probably it's healthy just to say, don't treat it like That's true. I personally don't see it like that, and I haven't seen that very often in Private Equity, mainly because if that was true, and people were therefore being over promoted, the performances would drop off. Well, they could actually performances. Everything results is real. It's really important. And I don't know an investor director that would take that risk.

Hannah Munro 22:06

So, I'm, I'm going to, I'm going to ask you another challenging one, Richie, I guess it's my last one. I get to ask these questions, right? Or all other things being equal, right? What would take precedence situational or industry experience versus Private Equity. Where would you go?

Richard Sanders 22:30

So, you're challenging me. I'm going to throw the question around a little bit. For me as an individual, the single most important thing that I recruit on is motivation. Okay, right? Single most important thing, I will address your question in a second, but that for me, this is not priority. This is, for me, is the most important thing, because you wouldn't be in the list if you didn't have broadly the right competencies. So, once I know that you're broadly capable of something we can work with you to finance gaps. Motivation is something you can't coach. It's really, really hard if someone's not motivated, if not impossible. So that's first place, the second place. It depends. So sometimes, particularly for a CFO, you could be entering a space where the sector is similar to other sectors, and deep experience in that sector is covered by the MD or CEO, the sales director, the ops director might not be important, so this will vary. I'm in the middle of working with a couple of infrastructure businesses. They're contracts businesses that do services to the construction sector. There is so much language in that sector, so much engineering in that sector, that if you haven't seen that before, you’re learning curve is at least two years’ worth of just getting the language right. Now, you can entertain people who are from outside of the sector. Of course you can, but there's an advantage in getting someone who's got that experience. So, I would it's, you know, horses for courses, which is why I go back to the motivation. Thing is, actually that is more important. And then final thought is, because I often get given people who've got Private Equity experience, but it's a different type of Private Equity experience, right? So, we've talked about Private Equity is not one thing, and because you've worked with a venture to be extreme does not mean you're going to cut it at large cap or the other way around. So be careful about what flavour of Private Equity you are. And again, if you're pitching yourself, don't just assume, oh, I've done Private Equity. What size, what type, what transformation, what part of the deal cycle that were you involved at? It can be it's not one thing.

Hannah Munro 24:45

I think that's a really interesting observation. It was a bit like I was chatting to somebody else on the podcast about their non exec director, and they said almost your first role can define you for the rest of your non exec career. It sounds like it might be quite. Similar in Private Equity, like the first one you take then sort of almost sets the scene for the next one that you will.

Richard Sanders 25:07

have after that. It can do. You can get typecast Right? Like, what can you sell yourself as well? I've done this before so I could sell myself as that. It's obviously, you know, that's good in a way. You specialise. You got to be really careful about it if you're trying to build a broader career. And I think for most CFOs like that, experience across multiple sectors, multiple stages of deal. If you haven't done M and A within a business, you really want to learn that bit as well. And all of that then builds your CV with regards to all sorts of Private Equity but first and foremost, being a great CFO.

Hannah Munro 25:46

Wow, weird of wisdom there. We've got a few more to go, so I'm going to, I'm going to get a keep going. This is interesting. Money is no object once you have Private Equity backers.

Richard Sanders 26:02

Yeah. I mean, yeah. I mean, good luck with that. No, it's different, isn't it? So you've got people around you now that are experts in getting hold of finance, in setting the capital structure to optimise return now to an extent that's optimising for value creation or further acquisitions or capex or systems build or whatever it is you might want to spend your money on, but it's actually the opposite of that myth, because what you've got is greater scrutiny, right? So, for qualifying investments, yes, you've just made life a lot easier the stuff that you shouldn't really be doing that's outside of the strategy, that's not a priority. You've just made it a load harder than like family had owned you, or it was a founder, or if you're part of a corporate, you might get away with it. So it should be that it's a more, you know, coherence, you know, financial strategy in terms of where you spend your money, and you'll have to justify non-core forever, because you probably won't be allowed to do non-core investments and everything will need a business case. Now the good news is you've also got people around you who really understand business cases and returns models and all of that. So, like with us, this doesn't slow down investment, it speeds it up. So, we've done investments, significant investments for businesses off the back of little more than an email, like a page of a four on an email and gone. We understand this business well enough to know that that is sound. We've asked a couple of questions, and we've gone and done it the next day. So, you know, people equally. I think another myth I've come up with is there's a load of red tape. It doesn't have to be. It depends on the house, and it depends on how close they are to what you're doing and also depends on whether what you're asking is close to the strategy you laid out at the beginning of the year or the beginning of the three years. So yeah, I think it could be very dynamic. Could be very positive in terms of capital, but yeah, it's not.

Hannah Munro 28:06

The end of the rainbow.

Richard Sanders 28:11

Don't just go and get to rate the cash till sort of freely.

Hannah Munro 28:17

Awesome. Some other interesting ones, your first priority of the CFO is to your Private Equity investor.

Richard Sanders 28:26

Yeah, well, I think people who've listened to these episodes, although I'm going to say it's just not as simple as that. So, I think I said really early on in this, transparency with a Private Equity house is critical. So, if they cannot trust you, it's close to game over, right? They have to be able to trust you. So, what that means, in the light of this question, is you cannot get yourself stuck in a situation where you are, where you know something about your business and you're not articulating it in a reasonable time. So that definitely doesn't mean tell them every problem, as it happens, don't do that, because you're expected to have answers, to mitigate things, to understand them, and don't run off saying the sky's falling in the moment you think there's a chance it might so you've got a bit of time, but you have to be transparent. So, in that sense, there is, you are reporting direct to Private Equity in a way that the formal line structure of you reporting into your CEO and then CEO up to the Private Equity house sometimes won't make that clear. And indeed, some businesses it won't be that you're doing well I've just said it will actually be the CEO that has all of the communication, so that'll be a different role. But typically, you've got to stay transparent with that investor director, and you'll often have separate contact with them. So that's how I treat it like I think the answer is to what do you do with that? Is transparent. Explain that to your CEO as well. And if that means, therefore, that you've got to come up with plans to mitigate a problem that's just arrived within 48 hours and then go to the investor director between the two of you, that's what you do. But yeah, you can't have it that nasty surprises arise three weeks after the event and you as the CFO, yeah, you knew, but you were told by the exact not to say anything like, got to be really careful with that.

Hannah Munro 30:27

Okay, so got, I think I've got two more, unless as another one sneaks its way in, I think we've got time so you will lose control of your business once you have Private Equity backers, true or false?

Richard Sanders 30:40

Absolutely not. I'll keep a simple answer on this, which is back to No. Private Equity House wants you to lose control. They want you to be accountable. So, this is the double-edged sword of that. It's like you've got the responsibility. It's your business. But what they will do is they'll set a framework so in this matchmaking that happens when the vendor is finding a Private Equity house, make sure that framework is going to work for the plan that you've got, the business that you've got, and the team that you are, and if it does, then you will not feel negative consequences of loss of control. It'll feel very natural. You'll be enabled by it. It'll be great. But yeah, if you think that you're going to have free reign to like we've just said, I want myth, spend money wherever you want, or hire whoever you want, or change the direction of the firm. No, you won't, right? Because that's not good governance, and nobody should want so in that sense, yes, you have an authority matrix. You do not have complete free reign. But I don't think in a way that you should, like, you know, repent the loss of it, right? It's for good, good, good impact.

Hannah Munro 31:51

Private Equity values being ruthless, they don't care how you deliver the return, as long as you do true or false.

Richard Sanders 32:02

Yeah. Well, I think I wanted the spectrum on this anyway, in terms of, I just don't believe that there aren't enough commercial opportunities that are also the right thing to do that you ever need to go outside of those things. And you'll see that in our approach to ESG diversity, and we've been on this for a long time, not just in the last five years. I mean, I'm ex John Lewis partnership, and there's a reason for that, right. So, values kind of course through me, and I can't help myself, so I just don't believe that you have to be ruthless in a sense of not being fair in order to have some exceptional results. And we've certainly proven that. I think what you have to be mindful of with Private Equity is results are really, really important. And that is a language that you will use at the board. It is not the exclusive language, like, we've been saying, but it might be more on you to talk about some of those other what might be argued softer factors than you would have, I don't know, with a founder, owner or with a kind of corporate board. I mean, maybe not. So where I would go on that is, actually, there's a lot of hope I've got for Private Equity at the moment, because I think doing the right thing, being sustainable in all senses, being equitable in all senses, there's a real strong growing movement within Private Equity to not just do the best, but do it the right way. And so, I think any of those that might have been around, I don't know, 20 years ago, perhaps doing things through a very ruthless plan. They're being weedled out, and they're not getting investment, actually, from investors in their funds. Like the requirements on Private Equity around ESG are higher now than they've ever been, and they're only going in one direction at the moment, and that's for good effect. It's because we all know that you can operate well in a doing the right thing kind of way and be very successful. We back ourselves to have the capability to make sure that that happens.

Hannah Munro 34:12

And that is a wonderful way to end the final podcast of this series, hopefully not the last on Private Equity. But I wanted to say a massive thank you rich for taking the time for this six-part episode on the Private Equity CFO. Now you know, as we've gone through this the process, you know, people might be interested in learning more about Sullivan Street Partners. So where can they find you? What's the best way to learn more about what it is that you do and how you do it?

Richard Sanders 34:41

Yeah, so if they go to our LinkedIn profile, which is under Sullivan Street Partners limited, or if they go to our website, which is Sullivan street.co.uk, you'll see case studies. You'll see our portfolio and a little bit on our approach, which, as I've reflected on through these episodes, is a bit different. We like to think it's a bit different. And doing things the right way, but, but equally, get in touch with me directly over LinkedIn. Happy to field questions because, yeah, I'm passionate about making sure people understand, well, hopefully more of the good of Private Equity than the good, the bad and the ugly. But yeah, we start somewhere.

Hannah Munro 35:16

I think we've given it a good go, and it's been fairly balanced, actually. So well done rich. We've not shied away from some of the toughest stuff, shall we say, in Private Equity, but still managed to get at some of the good stuff underneath. So, thank you so much. And to all of our listeners. If you have enjoyed this episode, don't just like and share it. Please reach out and let us know what you'd like to hear about next. We always want to hear your questions, your topics, perhaps, is something that Rich and I have talked about you'd like to learn more about. Please do let me know. It's been fantastic to have you rich. And thank you so much for joining us on the CFO 4.0 podcast.

Richard Sanders 35:56

It's been an absolute pleasure.

Unlock the real story behind Private Equity and discover why tuning in to “The Private Equity CFO | Myths, Mistakes & Misconceptions” is the smartest move you’ll make this week. In a fast-paced, myth-busting session, host Hannah Munro and veteran CFO Richard Sanders dismantle the half-truths that hold finance leaders back, and arm you with the insights you need to elevate your career and drive real value. This episode isn’t just a rundown of buzzwords—it’s a masterclass in striking the right balance between ambition and realism, building the investor pitch that wins trust, and navigating the complex incentives landscape with confidence. You’ll learn how to:

• Craft “challenging but achievable” budgets that excite Private Equity sponsors without setting yourself up for failure, and why stretching too far can seriously damage your credibility.

• Embrace rapid experimentation to accelerate learning and growth, rather than chasing perfection—and why admitting small mistakes early is the secret to long-term success.

• Decode equity vesting, “good leaver” versus “bad leaver” provisions, and the art of structuring your compensation so you truly benefit from the upside you create.

Along the way, Richard shares insider anecdotes from mid-market deals, explains why zero-growth plans won’t even get a table at the PE evaluation, and reveals how to maintain day-to-day control over your business while staying transparent with your investor-director. You’ll also discover why motivation beats pedigree, how to position your non-Big-4 background as an asset, and what it really takes to earn—and keep—the trust of a PE backer. Whether you’re a stalwart CFO looking to break into Private Equity, or an aspiring finance leader hungry for actionable strategies, this episode will challenge your assumptions and sharpen your playbook. Expect hard-hitting truths, laugh-out-loud banter, and pragmatic advice that you can start applying to your next board meeting or deal negotiation.

Don’t settle for superficial commentary or recycled talking points—dive deep into the mechanics of how top CFOs thrive in the PE environment. “The Private Equity CFO | Myths, Mistakes & Misconceptions” is your fast-track to mastering the language of profit, growth, and governance that separates average performers from industry game-changers.

Ready to rewrite your next CFO playbook? Tune in now and transform the way you think about Private Equity—and your future in it.